When I use yum and install software, N is the default choice. I feel that from usability perspective, yes should be the default value. I wanted to know if there was any motive behind this strange choice. Or was it that the developers of yum felt people would use install instead of info or deplist?
(However, I do feel that no must the be default as it is for removal of packages)
Also, I feel that for a system, one version of a package that has been downloaded should be kept on the hard disk and could be overwritten by the next release of the package. If a user installs a package and then uninstalls it and finally reinstalls it, he should not be redownloading the package. I find that only the downloaded and yet-to-be-installed packages are present in /var/cache/yum/*. The manpage of yum tells me that they are not automatically removed. But I found them to be automatically deleted after they have been installed(Fedora11)
On further probing, I found keepcache to be set to 0 in /etc/yum.conf. This contradicts with the manpage.
--- Ashok `ScriptDevil` Gautham
On 06/13/2009 07:26 PM, Ashok Gautham wrote:
When I use yum and install software, N is the default choice. I feel that from usability perspective, yes should be the default value. I wanted to know if there was any motive behind this strange choice. Or was it that the developers of yum felt people would use install instead of info or deplist?
(However, I do feel that no must the be default as it is for removal of packages)
Not sure why you find it strange. Install and removing software are both choices that users need to carefully think about before doing them. Software can pull in unexpected number of dependencies and having it all download without prompting is unhelpful. Removing software can be even more dangerous. Think about the consequences of user accidently doing something like yum remove glibc.
On further probing, I found keepcache to be set to 0 in /etc/yum.conf. This contradicts with the manpage.
File a bug report.
Rahul
On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Rahul Sundaramsundaram@fedoraproject.org wrote:
Software can pull in unexpected number of dependencies and having it all download without prompting is unhelpful. Removing software can be even more dangerous. Think about the consequences of user accidently doing something like yum remove glibc.
I agree that removing software can be dangerous. I did say that no should be the default for that (as it is now). I agree that many people may need it. I can do 2 ctrl-cs if I do make a mistake. I will fix it for myself :) I agree that the majority may need an N
File a bug report.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=505838 Done
--- Ashok `ScriptDevil` Gautham
On Sun, 2009-06-14 at 14:51 +0530, Ashok Gautham wrote:
On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Rahul Sundaramsundaram@fedoraproject.org wrote:
Software can pull in unexpected number of dependencies and having it all download without prompting is unhelpful. Removing software can be even more dangerous. Think about the consequences of user accidently doing something like yum remove glibc.
I agree that removing software can be dangerous. I did say that no should be the default for that (as it is now). I agree that many people may need it. I can do 2 ctrl-cs if I do make a mistake. I will fix it for myself :) I agree that the majority may need an N
File a bug report.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=505838 Done
Ashok `ScriptDevil` Gautham
hi,
For personal use.. You can always add "yum=yum -y" as an alias in the .bashrc .. Will work as a sort of default "y" ..
On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Ankur Sinhasanjay.ankur@gmail.com wrote:
For personal use.. You can always add "yum=yum -y" as an alias in the .bashrc .. Will work as a sort of default "y" .
That is most certainly not what I meant. I meant pressing Enter should be accepted as Yes. I would like a confirmation too. Many commands have a Press Enter for ok and press something else to make a change. That is the think that prompted me to ask the question here. I also fail to see why people cannot bail out with 2 Control C's incase they were too heavy handed. I mean, if they knew the exact package name, they would also 80% of the time know that they will get dependencies. Anyway, please consider this thread closed. I agree that N is a better default for such critical operations.
-- Ashok `ScriptDevil` Gautham
When I use yum and install software, N is the default choice. I feel that from usability perspective, yes should be the default value.
You must be a rich person with loads of bandwidth. :-)
Cheerio, Debarshi
Hi Ashok,
Ashok Gautham wrote:
When I use yum and install software, N is the default choice. I feel that from usability perspective, yes should be the default value. I wanted to know if there was any motive behind this strange choice. Or was it that the developers of yum felt people would use install instead of info or deplist?
yum automatically resolves dependencies and updates, installs (and sometimes even uninstalls) packages when asked to install/update a package. Due to these 'side-effects' it is always a good thing to question the user.
This is the reason why yum has an interactive prompt and rpm doesn't.
Of course if you are absolutely certain no harm can come from installing/updating a package and all it's dependencies, it does offer the '-y' flag (or the 'assumeyes' option in yum.conf(5) for the really brave ...or really stupid).
(However, I do feel that no must the be default as it is for removal of packages)
Also, I feel that for a system, one version of a package that has been downloaded should be kept on the hard disk and could be overwritten by the next release of the package. If a user installs a package and then uninstalls it and finally reinstalls it, he should not be redownloading the package. I find that only the downloaded and yet-to-be-installed packages are present in /var/cache/yum/*. The manpage of yum tells me that they are not automatically removed. But I found them to be automatically deleted after they have been installed(Fedora11)
On further probing, I found keepcache to be set to 0 in /etc/yum.conf. This contradicts with the manpage.
Seems like a bug in the man page, since IMHO keepcache=0 is a more general preference.
cheers, - steve
Somethings, like yum update --enablerepo=rawhide are JUST irreversible.
Also, you yum (like most console apps) doesn't only accept input at the prompt. If you accidently pressed enter, even when loading repo data, that enter is passed onto the prompt.
Try it: # yum update <enter> <enter>
Now aren't you glad than N is the default?
Anyway, there is no prompt for read only actions, like deplist and info (and they don't need root)
On Sat, 13 Jun 2009, Ashok Gautham sent out 1.2K bytes to say:
When I use yum and install software, N is the default choice. I feel that from usability perspective, yes should be the default value. I wanted to know if there was any motive behind this strange choice. Or was it that the developers of yum felt people would use install instead of info or deplist?
(However, I do feel that no must the be default as it is for removal of packages)
Also, I feel that for a system, one version of a package that has been downloaded should be kept on the hard disk and could be overwritten by the next release of the package. If a user installs a package and then uninstalls it and finally reinstalls it, he should not be redownloading the package. I find that only the downloaded and yet-to-be-installed packages are present in /var/cache/yum/*. The manpage of yum tells me that they are not automatically removed. But I found them to be automatically deleted after they have been installed(Fedora11)
On further probing, I found keepcache to be set to 0 in /etc/yum.conf. This contradicts with the manpage.
Ashok `ScriptDevil` Gautham
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