Hi all,
I wanted to take a second to point out some of the recent changes that have been made to the Fedora pages that are a part of www.redhat.com, coinciding with the release of fc5.
If you take a look, you'll see that we are running a promo on the www.redhat.com homepage that announces the release of fc5, and that clicking through it will drive you to www.redhat.com/fedora which has also taken on a new look. The fc5 release is a big deal around here, and we're treating it as such.
If you remember the old page that used to be there, you will remember that it was fairly devoid of information, and it did not make it particularly easy for the user to make it over to either fedora.redhat.com or to fedoraproject.org
That has all changed -- we have a bunch of direct links into fedoraproject.org that make it very clear (I hope) what the current version of Fedora is, how to download it, and other useful information, while playing well with the look and feel of Red Hat's other "top level" pages.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts and reactions. Let me know what you think, and whether or not you thing the new www.redhat.com/fedora does a good job of providing a window into the heart of the Fedora Project.
Max Spevack wrote:
Hi all,
I wanted to take a second to point out some of the recent changes that have been made to the Fedora pages that are a part of www.redhat.com, coinciding with the release of fc5.
If you take a look, you'll see that we are running a promo on the www.redhat.com homepage that announces the release of fc5, and that clicking through it will drive you to www.redhat.com/fedora which has also taken on a new look. The fc5 release is a big deal around here, and we're treating it as such.
If you remember the old page that used to be there, you will remember that it was fairly devoid of information, and it did not make it particularly easy for the user to make it over to either fedora.redhat.com or to fedoraproject.org
That has all changed -- we have a bunch of direct links into fedoraproject.org that make it very clear (I hope) what the current version of Fedora is, how to download it, and other useful information, while playing well with the look and feel of Red Hat's other "top level" pages.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts and reactions. Let me know what you think, and whether or not you thing the new www.redhat.com/fedora does a good job of providing a window into the heart of the Fedora Project.
I love the new page much better than the earlier version but a link to http://www.redhat.com/software/rhelorfedora/ is missing. We really should get spend some good amount of effort in revamping fedoraproject.org content with the new cms system in place (http://fpserv.fedoraproject.org/) and dismantle fedora.redhat.com after setting up appropriate redirects. I think we need help with the content and organization for fedoraproject.org from within Red Hat for the initial design. Shouldnt be too much work but is extremely critical that we dont retain a annoyingly sparse fedora.redhat.com for too long.
On Wed, 22 Mar 2006, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
I love the new page much better than the earlier version but a link to http://www.redhat.com/software/rhelorfedora/ is missing.
I'd like to clean that table up a bit, and then find a place to stick that link back on www.redhat.com/fedora -- thank you for reminding me of it.
We really should get spend some good amount of effort in revamping fedoraproject.org content with the new cms system in place (http://fpserv.fedoraproject.org/) and dismantle fedora.redhat.com after setting up appropriate redirects.
Yep, deprecating f.r.c is in our future -- that is why all of the links on www.redhat.com/fedora are pointing directly to fp.o instead of to f.r.c
--Max
On Wed, 22 Mar 2006, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
I love the new page much better than the earlier version but a link to http://www.redhat.com/software/rhelorfedora/ is missing. We really should get spend some good amount of effort in revamping fedoraproject.org content with the new cms system in place (http://fpserv.fedoraproject.org/) and dismantle fedora.redhat.com after setting up appropriate redirects. I think we need help with the content and organization for fedoraproject.org from within Red Hat for the initial design. Shouldnt be too much work but is extremely critical that we dont retain a annoyingly sparse fedora.redhat.com for too long.
Speaking of new web sites, I have the .PSD files of a new look for the web site that the design firm used by RH came up with. Really need to turn those into actual CSS + images at some point... It all meshes nicely with the stuff that has already been going on here and on fedora-websites-list.
Best, -- Elliot
On 3/21/06, Elliot Lee sopwith@redhat.com wrote:
Speaking of new web sites, I have the .PSD files of a new look for the web site that the design firm used by RH came up with. Really need to turn those into actual CSS + images at some point... It all meshes nicely with the stuff that has already been going on here and on fedora-websites-list.
Yes please, Elliot, if you could speed things up a bit, it would be wonderful--while we have all the buzz going from the new release :)
Cheers, Alex
Max Spevack wrote:
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts and reactions. Let me know what you think, and whether or not you thing the new www.redhat.com/fedora does a good job of providing a window into the heart of the Fedora Project.
One question - wasn't one of the main goals of the Fedora Foundation to differentiate between "Red Hat" and "Fedora" as two seperate entities?
"redhat.com/fedora" - this is even more 'Red Hat' than 'fedora.redhat.com'. Is Fedora a part of Red Hat now?
Cheers,
Jon
P.S I know Fedora and Red Hat are different, but this isn't how it looks to an 'external' person (I'm writing this email because I've just had an IM from a friend reading "So are Red Hat taking back Fedora then?")
On Wed, 2006-03-22 at 09:52 +0000, Jon Fautley wrote:
Max Spevack wrote:
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts and reactions. Let me know what you think, and whether or not you thing the new www.redhat.com/fedora does a good job of providing a window into the heart of the Fedora Project.
One question - wasn't one of the main goals of the Fedora Foundation to differentiate between "Red Hat" and "Fedora" as two seperate entities?
"redhat.com/fedora" - this is even more 'Red Hat' than 'fedora.redhat.com'. Is Fedora a part of Red Hat now?
I don't agree; this is no more "claiming" Fedora than any "example.com/fedora" link. Keep in mind this page has always been there, and it's a way to drive people looking for Fedora support at Red Hat to head for the community sites instead. There is no escaping that people *associate* Fedora with Red Hat, nor is that particularly a bad thing.
P.S I know Fedora and Red Hat are different, but this isn't how it looks to an 'external' person (I'm writing this email because I've just had an IM from a friend reading "So are Red Hat taking back Fedora then?")
This snippet might be more meaningful if you could ascertain how he arrived at this conclusion.
On Wed, 2006-03-22 at 08:03 -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote:
I don't agree; this is no more "claiming" Fedora than any "example.com/fedora" link. Keep in mind this page has always been there, and it's a way to drive people looking for Fedora support at Red Hat to head for the community sites instead. There is no escaping that people *associate* Fedora with Red Hat, nor is that particularly a bad thing.
Fedora is a project sponsored, in part, by Red Hat.
Heck, some people draw whatever conclusions they want _regardless_ of what the Fedora Project, Red Hat, etc... has on their site.
On 3/23/06, Bryan J. Smith b.j.smith@ieee.org wrote:
On Wed, 2006-03-22 at 08:03 -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote:
I don't agree; this is no more "claiming" Fedora than any "example.com/fedora" link. Keep in mind this page has always been there, and it's a way to drive people looking for Fedora support at Red Hat to head for the community sites instead. There is no escaping that people *associate* Fedora with Red Hat, nor is that particularly a bad thing.
Fedora is a project sponsored, in part, by Red Hat.
Heck, some people draw whatever conclusions they want _regardless_ of what the Fedora Project, Red Hat, etc... has on their site.
Right, Red Hat needs to have something about Fedora, fairly prominently placed on their on their site. The traffic redhat.com gets is RHEL related, and thusly the page should look like redhat.com, and lead folks gently to the different URL and very different look/feel/voice/content of the real Fedora home. Likewise, a fedoraproject page that mentioned Red Hat would look like a Fedora page.
Neither creates or even exaserbates the branding confusion. Remember when folks used to think Mandrake was further along than RHAT b/c they were on version 7 when Red Hat was only on version 6 of "Linux", or how SuSE would use it to their advantage and slap in a test kernel and rev their release days "don;t settle for Red Hat 9 when you can have SuSE 10! Now with unstable kernel!" ?
It took some education that began where folks were (completely ignorant of Linux v. a distribution), to get them where they are now (only mostly ignorant of Linux v. a distribuion) .
Red Hat invests more into and draws more from Fedora than any entity on the planet and so they are linked. The name is derived from Red Hat's brand, both sites mention each other and position the relationship, and a simple "this one is blue, that one is red" isn't going to instantly create a distinction when the subtext is obvious.
IMHO if Red Hat and Fedora ignored each other and pretended not to know each other it would seem confused, fractured, or even sleazy... sort of exactly how it was seen at launch when RH had marginalized it to "hobbyists" and declared it "unstable for production", and alluded to the possibility of monthly releases in order to ensure enough of the deeper pocketed folks bought into the new horse pill and didn't stay in community land.
I shit you not, I was once told to take Fedora off my laptop for a demo by a Red Hatter who himself didn't seem to know what it was.
There are also cross-over users to consider (ie anyone running RHEL, or certifying their apps or hardware on it, had better be running Fedora in a lab somewhere, and RH better tell me to do so in their site.)
At least Fedora is on their site, right out there in front of God and everybody, and positioned as what it is. And right where RH should let Fedora talk, well there's the handy link. If it's done right, folks can quickly opt-in to the right place, rather than feeling like they are optingout of one at the expense of the other. IMNSHO, it's the job of this group to tell folks what Fedora is, and who it's for when they get to the project pages.
--jeremy
marketing@lists.fedoraproject.org
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Alex -
Bryan Smith -
Elliot Lee -
Jeremy Hogan -
Jon Fautley -
Max Spevack -
Paul W. Frields -
Rahul Sundaram