NA Ambassador IRC meeting

[Matt McKenzie]

Hello fellow NA Ambassadors,
I would like to discuss the possibility of changing the weekly IRC NA
Ambassador meeting to another day.
I was able to attend for a while recently, but that has changed now.

I have started band practice, which is Tuesday nights, which runs right into
the meeting time.  Practice is 7pm-9pm PST, the IRC meeting starts and 6pm
PST and lasts until 7 or 8 depending, not to mention I get home at 5pm and
still need to eat dinner before practice.  This is a community concert band,
both my wife and I are in it.  I play French Horn and she plays Trombone.

Pretty much any other day of the week would work for me, same time slot is
OK (6pm PST, 9pm EST, 0100 UTC)
I spoke with ke4qqq and he also liked the idea of Wednesday evenings (6pm
Wednesday PST, 9pm Wednesday EST, 0100 Thursday UTC).

I don't want to inconvenience anyone else, but I also don't want to miss
these meetings.
If we don't change the meeting time I won't be able to attend.
So if any others would like (or wouldn't mind) and change in the time please
let's discuss it.

Again this is for the weekly North America IRC Ambassador meeting only.

Thanks!

-- 
----------
Matt M.
LinuxKnight

[Kevin Higgins]

I would not mind it changing days would like the time to stay the same
though...could not attend last night's meeting had to get last minute
things for school for my daughter.. will be attending from now on
though..

Kevin HIggins

[Brian Powell]

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 9:39 AM, Kevin Higgins <Admin(a)crossbytes.org&gt; wrote:
>  I would not mind it changing days would like the time to stay the
> same
>  though...could not attend last night's meeting had to get last minute
>  things for school for my daughter.. will be attending from now on
>  though..
>
>  Kevin HIggins
>
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>  https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list
>  
Wednesday evenings would not be a problem for me would prefer the time
stay the same as well.

-- 
Regards,

BrianPowell
http://fedoraproject.org

[inode0]

2008/9/3 Matt McKenzie <lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;:
>  Hello fellow NA Ambassadors,
>  I would like to discuss the possibility of changing the weekly IRC NA
>  Ambassador meeting to another day.
>  I was able to attend for a while recently, but that has changed now.
>
>  I have started band practice, which is Tuesday nights, which runs right into
>  the meeting time.  Practice is 7pm-9pm PST, the IRC meeting starts and 6pm
>  PST and lasts until 7 or 8 depending, not to mention I get home at 5pm and
>  still need to eat dinner before practice.  This is a community concert band,
>  both my wife and I are in it.  I play French Horn and she plays Trombone.
>
>  Pretty much any other day of the week would work for me, same time slot is
>  OK (6pm PST, 9pm EST, 0100 UTC)
>  I spoke with ke4qqq and he also liked the idea of Wednesday evenings (6pm
>  Wednesday PST, 9pm Wednesday EST, 0100 Thursday UTC).
>
>  I don't want to inconvenience anyone else, but I also don't want to miss
>  these meetings.
>  If we don't change the meeting time I won't be able to attend.
>  So if any others would like (or wouldn't mind) and change in the time please
>  let's discuss it.
>
>  Again this is for the weekly North America IRC Ambassador meeting only. 
Having been involved in meeting scheduling many times before I do have
some concerns about making changes like this. One thing is that there
will always be someone who the time doesn't work out well for, so
we'll likely get other requests for other times/days no matter what we
settle on. Worse, people have already made changes to their schedules
to accommodate the current time and changing it now means they need to
again make changes and with the expectation that it might well change
again in another month or two.

I'd suggest leaving it as is for some period of time, as the base
grows and more people want to actively participate in the meetings
revisit the time periodically (maybe on an annual or semi-annual basis
or something).

John

[Larry Cafiero]

Meeting last night?

Oops.

I have a class on Tuesday evening from 5:30 to 9:30 pacific time, and
while I can normally sit in the back of the class and attend an IRC
meeting (under the cover of "schoolwork" -- it's a Linux programming
class -- but yesterday I just plain forgot), I sort of fall in the
same category as Matt until December.

[Matt -- I used to play the french horn as well . . .]

I do agree with inode0, though -- we changed it once recently and it
may have caused others to change schedules to accommodate the meeting.

While revisiting the meeting time/date every few months or so, I would
also like to get a sense of the group to see how locked in to Tuesday
evenings we are.

So how locked in to Tuesday evenings (Wednesday morning UTC, I know) are we?

Larry Cafiero

PS -- I plan to agendize the news media "how-to" wiki for the next
meeting, just as a matter of an update. If all goes as planned, it
should be finished by Tuesday.

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 7:56 AM, inode0 <inode0(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  2008/9/3 Matt McKenzie <lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;:
> > Hello fellow NA Ambassadors,
> > I would like to discuss the possibility of changing the weekly IRC NA
> > Ambassador meeting to another day.
> > I was able to attend for a while recently, but that has changed now.
> >
> > I have started band practice, which is Tuesday nights, which runs right into
> > the meeting time.  Practice is 7pm-9pm PST, the IRC meeting starts and 6pm
> > PST and lasts until 7 or 8 depending, not to mention I get home at 5pm and
> > still need to eat dinner before practice.  This is a community concert band,
> > both my wife and I are in it.  I play French Horn and she plays Trombone.
> >
> > Pretty much any other day of the week would work for me, same time slot is
> > OK (6pm PST, 9pm EST, 0100 UTC)
> > I spoke with ke4qqq and he also liked the idea of Wednesday evenings (6pm
> > Wednesday PST, 9pm Wednesday EST, 0100 Thursday UTC).
> >
> > I don't want to inconvenience anyone else, but I also don't want to miss
> > these meetings.
> > If we don't change the meeting time I won't be able to attend.
> > So if any others would like (or wouldn't mind) and change in the time please
> > let's discuss it.
> >
> > Again this is for the weekly North America IRC Ambassador meeting only.
>
>  Having been involved in meeting scheduling many times before I do have
>  some concerns about making changes like this. One thing is that there
>  will always be someone who the time doesn't work out well for, so
>  we'll likely get other requests for other times/days no matter what we
>  settle on. Worse, people have already made changes to their schedules
>  to accommodate the current time and changing it now means they need to
>  again make changes and with the expectation that it might well change
>  again in another month or two.
>
>  I'd suggest leaving it as is for some period of time, as the base
>  grows and more people want to actively participate in the meetings
>  revisit the time periodically (maybe on an annual or semi-annual basis
>  or something).
>
>  John
>
>  --
>  Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list
>  Fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com
>  https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list
>

[Karsten Wade]

On Wed, 2008-09-03 at 09:17 -0700, Larry Cafiero wrote:

>  While revisiting the meeting time/date every few months or so, I
> would
>  also like to get a sense of the group to see how locked in to Tuesday
>  evenings we are. 
As much as I hate them ....

Doing a wiki page that shows all the time slots available might work?
We can stick to a slot of time such as evenings, if that is a consensus.

E.g.:

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings/Sch...

>  So how locked in to Tuesday evenings (Wednesday morning UTC, I know)
> are we? 
For that, I'm not; I suppose I could do Mon and Wed equally well.  Thu
and Fri I don't think I can do.  Weekends are iffy.

- Karsten
-- 
Karsten Wade, Sr. Developer Community Mgr.
Dev Fu : http://developer.redhatmagazine.com
Fedora : http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
gpg key : AD0E0C41

[Scott Williams]

May I suggest whenever one tree hill is on on the East coast.  My wife has to watch it.  I
could easily meet during that time.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: "Karsten 'quaid' Wade" <kwade(a)redhat.com&gt;

Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:48:33 
To: <fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] NA Ambassador IRC meeting


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[Brian Powell]

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 7:22 PM,  <vwfoxguru(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  May I suggest whenever one tree hill is on on the East coast.  My
> wife has to watch it.  I could easily meet during that time.
>  Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
>  -----Original Message-----
>  From: "Karsten 'quaid' Wade" <kwade(a)redhat.com&gt;
>
>  Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:48:33
>  To: <fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com&gt;
>  Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] NA Ambassador IRC meeting
>
>
>  --
>  Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list
>  Fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com
>  https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list
>
>
>
>  --
>  Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list
>  Fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com
>  https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list
>  

LOL! That is too funny...
-- 
Regards,

BrianPowell
http://fedoraproject.org

[Matt McKenzie]

OK so we have this consensus so far:

Any day but Tuesday, same time slot (9pm EST, 6pm PST, 0100 next morning
UTC)
wouldn't mind change to any other day, same time slot
Wednesday evenings, same time slot
keep it on Tuesday for now (couple months at least)
keep it for now, but open to change if consensus agrees
Monday or Wednesday evenings, same time slot, suggestion for Wiki planner
page
One Tree Hill time slot...?

So to boil it down, we have basically 5 votes to change it to some other
day, keeping same time slot (9pm EST/6pm PST), and 2 votes to keep it on
Tuesdays, with one of those open to suggestion of the consensus now, and the
other keeping it as is for a few months anyway.

As I said when I started this I don't want to inconvenience everyone else,
but I thought I would put this out at least, and see if anyone else wouldn't
mind the change, or wanted to change but hasn't spoken of it yet (sort of
trying to be the first one in class to raise their hand, though a lot of
people have the same question, kind of thing).

Anyone else?


-- 
----------
Matt M.
LinuxKnight

[Pascal Calarco]

I'm open to moving it to where the most folk can regularly attend.  I currently
do a radio show 8:00-10:00 pm every Wednesday, so likely would not be able to
make the meetings, but I am only one voice so that should not hold up the rest
of the group.

  - pascal

Quoting Matt McKenzie <lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;:

>  OK so we have this consensus so far:
>
>  Any day but Tuesday, same time slot (9pm EST, 6pm PST, 0100 next morning
>  UTC)
>  wouldn't mind change to any other day, same time slot
>  Wednesday evenings, same time slot
>  keep it on Tuesday for now (couple months at least)
>  keep it for now, but open to change if consensus agrees
>  Monday or Wednesday evenings, same time slot, suggestion for Wiki planner
>  page
>  One Tree Hill time slot...?
>
>  So to boil it down, we have basically 5 votes to change it to some other
>  day, keeping same time slot (9pm EST/6pm PST), and 2 votes to keep it on
>  Tuesdays, with one of those open to suggestion of the consensus now, and the
>  other keeping it as is for a few months anyway.
>
>  As I said when I started this I don't want to inconvenience everyone else,
>  but I thought I would put this out at least, and see if anyone else wouldn't
>  mind the change, or wanted to change but hasn't spoken of it yet (sort of
>  trying to be the first one in class to raise their hand, though a lot of
>  people have the same question, kind of thing).
>
>  Anyone else?
>
>
>  --
>  ----------
>  Matt M.
>  LinuxKnight
>

[Scott Williams]

Thursday works better for me.  7 or 8 PM EST on Tuesday or Thursday.  9 gets pretty late
with my new work schedule.


Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: pcalarco(a)nd.edu

Date: Wed,  3 Sep 2008 21:36:38 
To: <fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com>; Matt McKenzie&lt;lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;
Cc: <fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] NA Ambassador IRC meeting


I'm open to moving it to where the most folk can regularly attend.  I currently
do a radio show 8:00-10:00 pm every Wednesday, so likely would not be able to
make the meetings, but I am only one voice so that should not hold up the rest
of the group.

  - pascal

Quoting Matt McKenzie <lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;:

>  OK so we have this consensus so far:
>
>  Any day but Tuesday, same time slot (9pm EST, 6pm PST, 0100 next morning
>  UTC)
>  wouldn't mind change to any other day, same time slot
>  Wednesday evenings, same time slot
>  keep it on Tuesday for now (couple months at least)
>  keep it for now, but open to change if consensus agrees
>  Monday or Wednesday evenings, same time slot, suggestion for Wiki planner
>  page
>  One Tree Hill time slot...?
>
>  So to boil it down, we have basically 5 votes to change it to some other
>  day, keeping same time slot (9pm EST/6pm PST), and 2 votes to keep it on
>  Tuesdays, with one of those open to suggestion of the consensus now, and the
>  other keeping it as is for a few months anyway.
>
>  As I said when I started this I don't want to inconvenience everyone else,
>  but I thought I would put this out at least, and see if anyone else wouldn't
>  mind the change, or wanted to change but hasn't spoken of it yet (sort of
>  trying to be the first one in class to raise their hand, though a lot of
>  people have the same question, kind of thing).
>
>  Anyone else?
>
>
>  --
>  ----------
>  Matt M.
>  LinuxKnight
>  




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[inode0]

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 8:39 PM,  <vwfoxguru(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  Thursday works better for me.  7 or 8 PM EST on Tuesday or Thursday. 
> 9 gets pretty late with my new work schedule. 
7 out east is 4 out west, not good. Anything before 6 on the west
coast is unlikely to be very effective at attracting people from that
side of the continent. If the meeting is on a work night I have a very
strong preference for Tuesday or Wednesday.

I do think the general idea of meeting when the most people can meet
is a great one. I just don't think it should be voted on and changed
on a monthly basis. The ambassador pool will be growing if we are
successful in our mission and what is the best time will also be
changing.

Another option I'll float now, even though I know there will be some
resistance to it. There isn't any law requiring a weekly meeting to
meet the same day and time each week. Doing otherwise has two
drawbacks at least. One is that some people will just get confused
about when the meeting is and miss it. The other is that we get
something of a Venn diagram of participants, some attending at all
times, some at one, some at another. Having a unified voice and making
joint decisions at meetings is then problematic.

Despite those problems I would prefer an alternating schedule of 9pm
EST on Tuesdays with another time that makes people reasonably happy
the following week. If that day were Monday or Wednesday there
wouldn't be much impact from long or short weeks. If the time comes
when we scale back to maybe two meetings per month this might work
better, 1st Tuesday and 3rd Wednesday or something like that.

John

[Scott Williams]

It wouldn't be such a problem if Indiana would just quit screwing with it's time
zones.  Or else 9 would have been just right.  Blah.

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: inode0 <inode0(a)gmail.com&gt;

Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 21:30:19 
To: <fedora-ambassadors-list(a)redhat.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] NA Ambassador IRC meeting


On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 8:39 PM,  <vwfoxguru(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  Thursday works better for me.  7 or 8 PM EST on Tuesday or Thursday. 
> 9 gets pretty late with my new work schedule. 
7 out east is 4 out west, not good. Anything before 6 on the west
coast is unlikely to be very effective at attracting people from that
side of the continent. If the meeting is on a work night I have a very
strong preference for Tuesday or Wednesday.

I do think the general idea of meeting when the most people can meet
is a great one. I just don't think it should be voted on and changed
on a monthly basis. The ambassador pool will be growing if we are
successful in our mission and what is the best time will also be
changing.

Another option I'll float now, even though I know there will be some
resistance to it. There isn't any law requiring a weekly meeting to
meet the same day and time each week. Doing otherwise has two
drawbacks at least. One is that some people will just get confused
about when the meeting is and miss it. The other is that we get
something of a Venn diagram of participants, some attending at all
times, some at one, some at another. Having a unified voice and making
joint decisions at meetings is then problematic.

Despite those problems I would prefer an alternating schedule of 9pm
EST on Tuesdays with another time that makes people reasonably happy
the following week. If that day were Monday or Wednesday there
wouldn't be much impact from long or short weeks. If the time comes
when we scale back to maybe two meetings per month this might work
better, 1st Tuesday and 3rd Wednesday or something like that.

John

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[inode0]

2008/9/3 Matt McKenzie <lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;:
>  OK so we have this consensus so far:
>
>  Any day but Tuesday, same time slot (9pm EST, 6pm PST, 0100 next morning
>  UTC)
>  wouldn't mind change to any other day, same time slot
>  Wednesday evenings, same time slot
>  keep it on Tuesday for now (couple months at least)
>  keep it for now, but open to change if consensus agrees
>  Monday or Wednesday evenings, same time slot, suggestion for Wiki planner
>  page
>  One Tree Hill time slot...? 
Those are 7 different opinions, not a consensus.

>  So to boil it down, we have basically 5 votes to change it to some
> other
>  day, keeping same time slot (9pm EST/6pm PST), and 2 votes to keep it on
>  Tuesdays, with one of those open to suggestion of the consensus now, and the
>  other keeping it as is for a few months anyway. 
If we are going to vote it is going to be far more complicated. There
are 168 hours per week. So we each will cast a ballot assigning a
number from 0 to 168 for each hour of the week. Six weeks later we
will have the results of the 3 ballots tabulated and declare the
winning hour. :)

John

[Matt McKenzie]

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 7:39 PM, inode0 <inode0(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:

>  2008/9/3 Matt McKenzie <lnxknight(a)gmail.com&gt;:
>  > OK so we have this consensus so far:
>  >
>  > Any day but Tuesday, same time slot (9pm EST, 6pm PST, 0100 next morning
>  > UTC)
>  > wouldn't mind change to any other day, same time slot
>  > Wednesday evenings, same time slot
>  > keep it on Tuesday for now (couple months at least)
>  > keep it for now, but open to change if consensus agrees
>  > Monday or Wednesday evenings, same time slot, suggestion for Wiki planner
>  > page
>  > One Tree Hill time slot...?
>
>  Those are 7 different opinions, not a consensus. 

Yes my apologies, I was going on a more general meaning of consensus not a
strict literal meaning, and notice I added the modifier "so far".
How about "the opinions so far" then.  And yes they are not all agreeing on
the same thing, my point was they all agree to change it from Tuesday to
"something else".


>  > So to boil it down, we have basically 5 votes to change it to some other
>  > day, keeping same time slot (9pm EST/6pm PST), and 2 votes to keep it on
>  > Tuesdays, with one of those open to suggestion of the consensus now, and
>  the
>  > other keeping it as is for a few months anyway.
>
>  If we are going to vote it is going to be far more complicated. There
>  are 168 hours per week. So we each will cast a ballot assigning a
>  number from 0 to 168 for each hour of the week. Six weeks later we
>  will have the results of the 3 ballots tabulated and declare the
>  winning hour. :)
>
>  John 


Well if you are more experienced in dealing with issues like this what would
you suggest?
Are you good with "herding cats"? :)

Anyway if the group wants to keep it on Tuesdays then fine.  I'll just catch
up afterward on the report log on the list, and wait until the meeting time
gets changed, or something.


-- 
----------
Matt M.
LinuxKnight