Re: Icons in Xfce Menu

[Raphael Groner]

Hi Kevin,

how many applications are listed in the menu of the Live CD? I doubt
that those few icons would make any significant difference to cache
issues. Users can always disable the icons in their installed systems.
I am afraid that new users won't get noticed that there can be those
icons visible in the menu, they would have to examine some FAQ or look
into all the settings.

Further, there will be no sense for icons theming any more for the Live
CD, is it? How much space can be saved then in the LiveCD image (ISO)?
I expect again a flamewar about default themes and so on …

Please keep unneeded support effort as less as possible with the
existing good experience of Xfce for especially new users. :)

And: Fedora → Features etc.

A minimalist should not use Fedora.

Just my 5ct.

–Raphael


>  Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2012 11:33:28 -0600
>  From: Kevin Fenzi <kevin(a)scrye.com&gt;
>  To: xfce(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  Subject: Re: Icons in Xfce Menu
>  Message-ID: <20121005113328.47ef85a1(a)jelerak.scrye.com&gt;
>  Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>  
>  Yeah, sorry I missed this thread. 
>  
>  It's default that way in 4.10. 
>  
>  I think to allow menus to map faster... 
>  
>  Do people feel strongly about changing the default? 
>  Adding icons it will make the menus slower and use more memory. 
>  
>  I personally don't feel too strongly about it one way or the other,
>  but tend to just want to follow upstream where sensible. ;) 
>  
>  kevin

Icons in Xfce Menu

[Sergio Cipolla]

On 10/06/2012 10:58 AM, Raphael Groner wrote:

>  And: Fedora → Features etc.
>
>  A minimalist should not use Fedora.
>  
Someone must have forgotten to tell that to the GNOME people ;-)

I'll take it that you didn't word very well your phrase.
Sure Fedora isn't the most lightweight Linux around but regarding the 
desktop, the trait I've observed so far is more towards shipping vanilla 
settings.

As for the icons, currently I've have no direct opinion. If I was a 
distro builder I would probably enable not only them but tooltips on the 
menu as well, exactly because these settings are so easy to change.
I think no icons won't be a significant support issue. People trying the 
live-cd will just click and try whatever they don't know about. But one 
or other most likely will ask how to enable them.

Icons in Xfce Menu

[Marcus Moeller]

Hi all,

> > Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2012 11:33:28 -0600
> > From: Kevin Fenzi <kevin(a)scrye.com&gt;
> > To: xfce(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
> > Subject: Re: Icons in Xfce Menu
> > Message-ID: <20121005113328.47ef85a1(a)jelerak.scrye.com&gt;
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >
> > Yeah, sorry I missed this thread.
> >
> > It's default that way in 4.10.
> >
> > I think to allow menus to map faster...
> >
> > Do people feel strongly about changing the default?
> > Adding icons it will make the menus slower and use more memory.
> >
> > I personally don't feel too strongly about it one way or the other,
> > but tend to just want to follow upstream where sensible. ;) 
Disabling the icons in the menu does not really make it load faster, 
even on low-spec machines (I have tried that on an old single-core Atom).

Icons are a good help for finding items in menus. I most often refer to 
menu position and icon when I am opening menu entries I already know.

For someone who does not know what a program name means, icons are also 
a good orientation.

I agree with you that following upstream is a good idea in general, but 
not in this case. This is a position I share with nearly all other Xfce 
Distros that ship 4.10. I personally know not one which disables icons 
in menus.

Greets
Marcus

Icons in Xfce Menu

[Sergio Cipolla]

On 10/06/2012 11:43 AM, Marcus Moeller wrote:
>  Hi all,
>
> >> Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2012 11:33:28 -0600
> >> From: Kevin Fenzi <kevin(a)scrye.com&gt;
> >> To: xfce(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
> >> Subject: Re: Icons in Xfce Menu
> >> Message-ID: <20121005113328.47ef85a1(a)jelerak.scrye.com&gt;
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>
> >> Yeah, sorry I missed this thread.
> >>
> >> It's default that way in 4.10.
> >>
> >> I think to allow menus to map faster...
> >>
> >> Do people feel strongly about changing the default?
> >> Adding icons it will make the menus slower and use more memory.
> >>
> >> I personally don't feel too strongly about it one way or the other,
> >> but tend to just want to follow upstream where sensible. ;)
>
>  Disabling the icons in the menu does not really make it load faster,
>  even on low-spec machines (I have tried that on an old single-core Atom).
>
>  Icons are a good help for finding items in menus. I most often refer to
>  menu position and icon when I am opening menu entries I already know.
>
>  For someone who does not know what a program name means, icons are also
>  a good orientation.
>
>  I agree with you that following upstream is a good idea in general, but
>  not in this case. This is a position I share with nearly all other Xfce
>  Distros that ship 4.10. I personally know not one which disables icons
>  in menus.
>
>  Greets
>  Marcus 
I must check on the live-cd but for a completely new user, no icons 
don't make much difference but tooltips do.
For people that are familiar with the Linux apps icons make it faster to 
localize them.

Maybe it isn't the case with the app selection and icon theme on the 
spin but with many apps or depending on the icon theme it can delay 
loading. But overall as Raphael said, this particular setting seems to 
have not much weight when much resources are used by other things like 
system services.

Icons in Xfce Menu

[Marcus Moeller]

Hi all,

> >>> Do people feel strongly about changing the default?
> >>> Adding icons it will make the menus slower and use more memory.
> >>>
> >>> I personally don't feel too strongly about it one way or the other,
> >>> but tend to just want to follow upstream where sensible. ;)
> >
> > Disabling the icons in the menu does not really make it load faster,
> > even on low-spec machines (I have tried that on an old single-core Atom).
> >
> > Icons are a good help for finding items in menus. I most often refer to
> > menu position and icon when I am opening menu entries I already know.
> >
> > For someone who does not know what a program name means, icons are also
> > a good orientation.
> >
> > I agree with you that following upstream is a good idea in general, but
> > not in this case. This is a position I share with nearly all other Xfce
> > Distros that ship 4.10. I personally know not one which disables icons
> > in menus.
> >
> > Greets
> > Marcus
>
>  I must check on the live-cd but for a completely new user, no icons
>  don't make much difference but tooltips do. 
I still think both things make a difference. E.g. an icon of an envelope 
can be easily associated with an eMail application, an icon of a Folder 
can be associated with a file manager. Of course that's not the case for 
all icons, but for many.

Greets
Marcus

Icons in Xfce Menu

[Matthew Miller]

On Sat, Oct 06, 2012 at 03:58:52PM +0200, Raphael Groner wrote:
>  A minimalist should not use Fedora. 
Features doesn't mean everyone has to have _all_ of the features at once.

-- 
Matthew Miller  ☁☁☁  Fedora Cloud Architect  ☁☁☁  <mattdm(a)fedoraproject.org&gt;