Translation freeze dates & FC6T3

[Dimitris Glezos]

I'm not sure how this happened, but many translations that were made before 3/9,
did not make it into FC6T3. From the Schedule I see that the development freeze
is 5/9.

I saw it at least in anaconda, -config-date and comps-po.

Furthermore, even if devel freeze is 5/9, the translation has no reason to stop
at that time. At least that happens in GNOME, where translation continues after
the string freeze and the hard freeze?

  http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointSeventeen

-dim


-- 
Dimitris Glezos
Jabber ID: glezos(a)jabber.org, GPG: 0xA5A04C3B
http://dimitris.glezos.com/


"He who gives up functionality for ease of use
loses both and deserves neither." (Anonymous)
--

[A S Alam]

Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
>  I'm not sure how this happened, but many translations that were
> made before 3/9,
>  did not make it into FC6T3. From the Schedule I see that the development freeze
>  is 5/9.
>  
>  I saw it at least in anaconda, -config-date and comps-po.
>  
>  Furthermore, even if devel freeze is 5/9, the translation has no reason to stop
>  at that time. At least that happens in GNOME, where translation continues after
>  the string freeze and the hard freeze?
>  
>    http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointSeventeen
>  
>  -dim
>  
>   
Yes, I agree with you regarding this about stop translation.
but anything done now *may or may not* get in. prodding the maintainer
is always helpful
it shouldn't be a problem at this point
if you try it the week of the final freeze, then however... :)

thanks

-- 
A S Alam
timezone: GMT+5:30
join us at #fedora-l10n (freenode)

"Either find a way or make one"

[Dimitris Glezos]

O/H A S Alam έγραψε:
>  Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
> > I'm not sure how this happened, but many translations that were
> > made before 3/9, did not make it into FC6T3. From the Schedule I
> > see that the development freeze is 5/9.
> > 
> > I saw it at least in anaconda, -config-date and comps-po.
> > 
> > Furthermore, even if devel freeze is 5/9, the translation has no 
> > reason to stop at that time. At least that happens in GNOME, where
> > translation continues after the string freeze and the hard freeze?
> > 
> > http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointSeventeen
> > 
> > -dim
> > 
> > 
>  Yes, I agree with you regarding this about stop translation. but 
>  anything done now *may or may not* get in. prodding the maintainer is
>   always helpful it shouldn't be a problem at this point if you try it
>   the week of the final freeze, then however... :) 
To be honest, it was *very* hard for me to find time just before the
freeze, but I did find it and corrected mistakes in *all* the packages
so that the greek community can give us feedback from test3. It is sad
to find out that those sleepless nights were not necessary... And of
course I'm sure many other contributors might feel the same way.

The feedback we receive from the community always comes from test
releases. Especially from the test3 release.

Can we have then a point on the schedule where the translations should
freeze, so that maintainers know when they should grab a fresh copy of
the po files. I'm suppose this could be done even at the last moment.


Thanks.

-dim


-- 
Dimitris Glezos
Jabber ID: glezos(a)jabber.org, PGP: 0xA5A04C3B
http://dimitris.glezos.com/

"He who gives up functionality for ease of use
loses both and deserves neither." (Anonymous)
--

[A S Alam]

Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
>  O/H A S Alam έγραψε:
> > Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
> >> I'm not sure how this happened, but many translations that were
> >> made before 3/9, did not make it into FC6T3. From the Schedule I
> >> see that the development freeze is 5/9.
> >>
> >> I saw it at least in anaconda, -config-date and comps-po.
> >>
> >> Furthermore, even if devel freeze is 5/9, the translation has no 
> >> reason to stop at that time. At least that happens in GNOME, where
> >> translation continues after the string freeze and the hard freeze?
> >>
> >> http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointSeventeen
> >>
> >> -dim
> >>
> >>
> > Yes, I agree with you regarding this about stop translation. but 
> > anything done now *may or may not* get in. prodding the maintainer is
> >  always helpful it shouldn't be a problem at this point if you try it
> >  the week of the final freeze, then however... :)
>  
>  To be honest, it was *very* hard for me to find time just before the
>  freeze, but I did find it and corrected mistakes in *all* the packages
>  so that the greek community can give us feedback from test3. It is sad
>  to find out that those sleepless nights were not necessary... And of
>  course I'm sure many other contributors might feel the same way.
>   
Not all packages will rebuild, only package, which have some
critical bugs will be rebuild, so it is good to fix translation before
14 Sept.

>  The feedback we receive from the community always comes from test
>  releases. Especially from the test3 release.
>  
>  Can we have then a point on the schedule where the translations should
>  freeze, so that maintainers know when they should grab a fresh copy of
>  the po files. I'm suppose this could be done even at the last moment.
>  
>   
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Core/Schedule
"5 September  FC6 Test3 Development Freeze" means String freeze
"14 September FC6 Test3 Release" Last date to submit string
but as string changes for anaconda and some other package, so
you can update string as Maintainer is building package again

if you find that your translation is major issue for your
language for any package, please file a bug against package
and ask maintainer to rebuild package or include translation in next
rebuild

regards
-- 
A S Alam
timezone: GMT+5:30
join us at #fedora-l10n (freenode)

"Either find a way or make one"

[Nikos Charonitakis]

On 9/15/06, A S Alam <aalam(a)redhat.com&gt; wrote:
>  Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
>  > O/H A S Alam έγραψε:
>  >> Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
>  >>> I'm not sure how this happened, but many translations that were
>  >>> made before 3/9, did not make it into FC6T3. From the Schedule I
>  >>> see that the development freeze is 5/9.
>  >>>
>  >>> I saw it at least in anaconda, -config-date and comps-po.
>  >>>
>  >>> Furthermore, even if devel freeze is 5/9, the translation has no
>  >>> reason to stop at that time. At least that happens in GNOME, where
>  >>> translation continues after the string freeze and the hard freeze?
>  >>>
>  >>> http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointSeventeen
>  >>>
>  >>> -dim
>  >>>
>  >>>
>  >> Yes, I agree with you regarding this about stop translation. but
>  >> anything done now *may or may not* get in. prodding the maintainer is
>  >>  always helpful it shouldn't be a problem at this point if you try it
>  >>  the week of the final freeze, then however... :)
>  >
>  > To be honest, it was *very* hard for me to find time just before the
>  > freeze, but I did find it and corrected mistakes in *all* the packages
>  > so that the greek community can give us feedback from test3. It is sad
>  > to find out that those sleepless nights were not necessary... And of
>  > course I'm sure many other contributors might feel the same way.
>  >
>  Not all packages will rebuild, only package, which have some
>  critical bugs will be rebuild, so it is good to fix translation before
>  14 Sept.
>
>  > The feedback we receive from the community always comes from test
>  > releases. Especially from the test3 release.
>  >
>  > Can we have then a point on the schedule where the translations should
>  > freeze, so that maintainers know when they should grab a fresh copy of
>  > the po files. I'm suppose this could be done even at the last moment.
>  >
>  >
>  http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Core/Schedule
>  "5 September  FC6 Test3 Development Freeze" means String freeze
>  "14 September FC6 Test3 Release" Last date to submit string
>  but as string changes for anaconda and some other package, so
>  you can update string as Maintainer is building package again
>
>  if you find that your translation is major issue for your
>  language for any package, please file a bug against package
>  and ask maintainer to rebuild package or include translation in next
>  rebuild 
maintainers have to build all packages that contain even a single line
of updated translations.
Not included translations has always been a problem with fedora/redhat
translation project and it has to be fixed.
As dimitris pointed in his message it's not nice people volunteer
their time for nothing...

regards
Nikos
>  regards
>  --
>  A S Alam
>  timezone: GMT+5:30
>  join us at #fedora-l10n (freenode)
>
>  "Either find a way or make one"
>
>  --
>  Fedora-trans-list mailing list
>  Fedora-trans-list(a)redhat.com
>  https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-trans-list
>

[Thomas Canniot]

Le vendredi 15 septembre 2006 à 17:27 +0300, Nikos Charonitakis a
écrit :
>  On 9/15/06, A S Alam <aalam(a)redhat.com&gt; wrote:
>  > Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
>  > > O/H A S Alam έγραψε:
>  > >> Dimitris Glezos ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
>  > >>> I'm not sure how this happened, but many translations that were
>  > >>> made before 3/9, did not make it into FC6T3. From the Schedule I
>  > >>> see that the development freeze is 5/9.
>  > >>>
>  > >>> I saw it at least in anaconda, -config-date and comps-po.
>  > >>>
>  > >>> Furthermore, even if devel freeze is 5/9, the translation has no
>  > >>> reason to stop at that time. At least that happens in GNOME, where
>  > >>> translation continues after the string freeze and the hard freeze?
>  > >>>
>  > >>> http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointSeventeen
>  > >>>
>  > >>> -dim
>  > >>>
>  > >>>
>  > >> Yes, I agree with you regarding this about stop translation. but
>  > >> anything done now *may or may not* get in. prodding the maintainer is
>  > >>  always helpful it shouldn't be a problem at this point if you try it
>  > >>  the week of the final freeze, then however... :)
>  > >
>  > > To be honest, it was *very* hard for me to find time just before the
>  > > freeze, but I did find it and corrected mistakes in *all* the packages
>  > > so that the greek community can give us feedback from test3. It is sad
>  > > to find out that those sleepless nights were not necessary... And of
>  > > course I'm sure many other contributors might feel the same way.
>  > >
>  > Not all packages will rebuild, only package, which have some
>  > critical bugs will be rebuild, so it is good to fix translation before
>  > 14 Sept.
>  >
>  > > The feedback we receive from the community always comes from test
>  > > releases. Especially from the test3 release.
>  > >
>  > > Can we have then a point on the schedule where the translations should
>  > > freeze, so that maintainers know when they should grab a fresh copy of
>  > > the po files. I'm suppose this could be done even at the last moment.
>  > >
>  > >
>  > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Core/Schedule
>  > "5 September  FC6 Test3 Development Freeze" means String freeze
>  > "14 September FC6 Test3 Release" Last date to submit string
>  > but as string changes for anaconda and some other package, so
>  > you can update string as Maintainer is building package again
>  >
>  > if you find that your translation is major issue for your
>  > language for any package, please file a bug against package
>  > and ask maintainer to rebuild package or include translation in next
>  > rebuild
>  maintainers have to build all packages that contain even a single line
>  of updated translations.
>  Not included translations has always been a problem with fedora/redhat
>  translation project and it has to be fixed.
>  As dimitris pointed in his message it's not nice people volunteer
>  their time for nothing...
>  
>  regards
>  Nikos
>  >
>  > regards 
It's either not nice to push new .pot files near the end.

http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=206620


-- 
Thomas Canniot
http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasCanniot

[Dimitris Glezos]

O/H Nikos Charonitakis έγραψε:
>  On 9/15/06, A S Alam <aalam(a)redhat.com&gt; wrote:
> > [...]
> > if you find that your translation is major issue for your
> > language for any package, please file a bug against package
> > and ask maintainer to rebuild package or include translation in next
> > rebuild
>
>  maintainers have to build all packages that contain even a single line
>  of updated translations.
>  Not included translations has always been a problem with fedora/redhat
>  translation project and it has to be fixed.
>  As dimitris pointed in his message it's not nice people volunteer
>  their time for nothing... 
A bug report was opened for this issue:

  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=207095

I agree with Nikos that it is important to have a consistent policy for this:
Core packages should always be rebuilt before releases. *At least* the Fedora
ones, those that have po files in the i18n CVS.

I understand that this is different from what happens today. But that doesn't
mean we shouldn't consider changing it, if it is for the good of the Fedora Project.

-dim


>  
>  regards
>  Nikos
> >
> > regards
> > -- 
> > A S Alam
> > timezone: GMT+5:30
> > join us at #fedora-l10n (freenode)
> >
> > "Either find a way or make one"
> >
> > -- 
> > Fedora-trans-list mailing list
> > Fedora-trans-list(a)redhat.com
> > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-trans-list
> > 

-- 
Dimitris Glezos
Jabber ID: glezos(a)jabber.org, GPG: 0xA5A04C3B
http://dimitris.glezos.com/


"He who gives up functionality for ease of use
loses both and deserves neither." (Anonymous)
--

[Thomas Canniot]

Le mardi 19 septembre 2006 à 13:06 +0100, Dimitris Glezos a écrit :
>  O/H Nikos Charonitakis έγραψε:
>  > On 9/15/06, A S Alam <aalam(a)redhat.com&gt; wrote:
>  >> [...]
>  >> if you find that your translation is major issue for your
>  >> language for any package, please file a bug against package
>  >> and ask maintainer to rebuild package or include translation in next
>  >> rebuild
>  >
>  > maintainers have to build all packages that contain even a single line
>  > of updated translations.
>  > Not included translations has always been a problem with fedora/redhat
>  > translation project and it has to be fixed.
>  > As dimitris pointed in his message it's not nice people volunteer
>  > their time for nothing...
>  
>  A bug report was opened for this issue:
>  
>    https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=207095
>  
>  I agree with Nikos that it is important to have a consistent policy for this:
>  Core packages should always be rebuilt before releases. *At least* the Fedora
>  ones, those that have po files in the i18n CVS.
>  
>  I understand that this is different from what happens today. But that doesn't
>  mean we shouldn't consider changing it, if it is for the good of the Fedora Project.
We have to change it, because it IS for the good of the fedora project.

There are lots of packages that have not been rebuild since Test1 with
translation : one stricking example : system-config-printer

This is a major config tool, this is not an understandable situation for
me, and it IS very frustrating. 
What kind of image are we going to show to the French community, that i
have advertised about the well going of fc6 translations (fc5 was not
well translated at all in french)?

They will openly ask me, "what's the matter with system-config-tool" ?
what have you been doing ? Should I explain that the Fedora Project
failed somewhere ?

-- 
Thomas Canniot
http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasCanniot

[Thomas Canniot]

>  They will openly ask me, "what's the matter with
> system-config-tool" ?
>  what have you been doing ? Should I explain that the Fedora Project
>  failed somewhere ?
>   
Fixing typo for better understanding ...

They will openly ask me "what's the matter with system-config-printer?
what have you been doing?"

Should I explain that the Fedora Project failed somewhere ?


-- 
Thomas Canniot
http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasCanniot

[Igor Pires Soares]

Hello!

Thomas, I share you frustration. We from Brazilian Portuguese
Translation Team have got almost 100% of modules translated, but many of
them are still in English on FC6T3, mainly system-config-printer. By
now, many modules have a mix between English and Portuguese, even if
they are 100% translated. Small modules like system-config-boot do not
show any modifications we have made months ago.

I really do think we need a better policy for this issue, otherwise we
would have to file a bug for many packages.

Regards,
Igor Pires Soares

Em Qui, 2006-09-21 às 00:13 +0200, Thomas Canniot escreveu:
>  > They will openly ask me, "what's the matter with
> system-config-tool" ?
>  > what have you been doing ? Should I explain that the Fedora Project
>  > failed somewhere ?
>  > 
>  
>  Fixing typo for better understanding ...
>  
>  They will openly ask me "what's the matter with system-config-printer?
>  what have you been doing?"
>  
>  Should I explain that the Fedora Project failed somewhere ?
>  
>

[Dimitris Glezos]

O/H Igor Pires Soares έγραψε:
>  Thomas, I share you frustration. We from Brazilian Portuguese
>  Translation Team have got almost 100% of modules translated, but many of
>  them are still in English on FC6T3, mainly system-config-printer.
>  [...]
>  I really do think we need a better policy for this issue, otherwise we
>  would have to file a bug for many packages.
>
>  Em Qui, 2006-09-21 às 00:13 +0200, Thomas Canniot escreveu:
> > They will openly ask me "what's the matter with system-config-printer?
> > what have you been doing?"
> >
> > Should I explain that the Fedora Project failed somewhere ? 

Thomas and Igor, could you put your comments up on the bug report? This way they
will be organized for reference.

  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=207095


Alam, Chester, what can we/you do to change this policy?

-dim


-- 
Dimitris Glezos
Jabber ID: glezos(a)jabber.org, GPG: 0xA5A04C3B
http://dimitris.glezos.com/

"He who gives up functionality for ease of use
loses both and deserves neither." (Anonymous)
--